Fury vs Wilder II

Discussion in 'Boxing News and Discussion' started by Michael Matos, Dec 27, 2019.

  1. Michael Matos

    Michael Matos Member

    Jeo Santisima suffered a fractured eye socket in his loss to Emanuel Naverrete last night.
     
  2. Remus

    Remus Member

    Jay Deas’ comments about the stoppage are flat out irresponsible.
     
  3. Hawaiianpunch

    Hawaiianpunch Banned

    Who the fuck is Jay Dead???

    My bad I didn't know that was the name Wilders trainer. Yeah man ridiculous. Wilders sparred hundreds of rounds, ran God knows how many miles to get ready for 6 weeks but it was the heavy transformer costume that wore him out. Not the fact that he never trained him how to throw a hook or a single body shot. Or that he never taught him to string combinations instead of telegraphing the same right hand round after round. No wonder I've never heard of this clown. So called boxing trainer.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2020
  4. Greenstone

    Greenstone Member



    John Fury Tyson's father and doppleganger with some very insightful comments prefight.
     
  5. Michael Matos

    Michael Matos Member

    Here's the thing. Before a fight, any fight, a chief second is identified and to the referees and commission the chief second calls the shots. You can be the head trainer or co trainer or whatever you want to be but if you aren't the chief second it's not your call, you can disagree all you want but it's not your call.

    When Ali lost to Holmes it was a lot of disagreement in the corner and I think Richard Greene was the referee and he walked over and Dundee told him loud and clear and you can hear it. I'm the chief second and I'm stopping the fight.
     
  6. Hawaiianpunch

    Hawaiianpunch Banned

    Gotta love Fury. He's a classy guy. Beats up the hardest puncher in boxing for 7 rds. Then after the fight is over sings a song for everybody in the arena. I mean who does that? The guy is a showman.
     
  7. Hawaiianpunch

    Hawaiianpunch Banned

    Wilder will never beat Fury. He has a low boxing iq. Like chimp trying to out smart a human. That's how big a difference there is between these two.
     
  8. Remus

    Remus Member

    Im not commenting about the rules or processes, I’m talking about the mindset. The fact that he said shit like he shoulda left him in there to “go out on his shield”. That shows his mindset and it’s absolutely not in the best interests of wilder or boxing. Its fine for Deontay to say and feel that. This is his nature and indeed his job. It’s NOT ok for his trainer to say that given the circumstances in this fight. Not ok AT ALL.

    Deontay lost his legs early, even before the KD he looked odd, wobbly. After the KD he was a shot duck. This is a title fight and wilder is a warrior agree, so you give the dude 2-3 rnds to try and shake it off and regain some composure...to show some resistance. To give you and indication he is still in it and not in serious danger. If he doesn’t do that then you gotta call it.

    Deontay was unresponsive in his corner, his legs never came back, his balance was out, he was bleeding from the mouth and ear, his jaw was swollen, his right eye was swelling and he had a 270 pnd dude coming for him. Most importantly he never looked for a second like he was gonna come back or that fury was tiring. To say that stoppage was premature and say some stupid shit like let him go out on his shield like there’s some honour in getting beaten within an inch of his life and then getting KTFO is irresponsible and damn sadistic. I’m really angry about this.
     
  9. mex fighter

    mex fighter Meqcksykin

    Breland saved Wilder's life.
     
    Remus likes this.
  10. Michael Matos

    Michael Matos Member

    Point taken. That was the first I had heard of Deas comments. I'd be interested to hear from Kenny Bayless. He hesitated to call that first knockdown a knockdown in fact it was very UnBayless like. He had some doubts as to whether that was a legal punch. Years from ow maybe sooner Bayless is going to say he regrets that decision to call that a knockdown and say that he should have stopped the fight right there. Probably felt he would have caught a lot of shit for that because he would have had to declare the fight a no contest and that would not have been a pretty scenario.
     
    Remus likes this.
  11. Remus

    Remus Member

    for someone on a boxing site, you show a pretty low understanding of this fight and the combatants involved. especially wilder.

    here's the truth of the matter, it all comes down to one punch. that's literally all it comes down to. it just so happened that wilder could not land the shot in this fight. if he DID land the shot and knocked fury out guess what it would change ?nothing, nothing at all. we'd still be saying fury is a better boxer and wilder is a seriously limited fighter with that great equalizer. sure wilder could improve his chances by boxing a bit better, using some variation, developing more skills. sure he could. but do you really think that at this stage of his career wilder is gonna all of a sudden develop into a boxer who could outbox fury ? not a chance in hell. so its all about the right hand. that's all it is. thats indeed what makes wilder so exciting.

    leading into a 3rd, if indeed that option is taken, the exact same formula will apply...can wilder land the shot or not. if he does land it, nothing changes. if he doesn't land it nothing changes. the scenario will be the exact same regardless of the result. if widler lands it fury is still a superior boxer and deontay still is a devastating one punch specialist. if he doesn't land it fury is still a superior boxer and deontay is still a devastaing one punch specialist. its really no more complicated than that. all that talk about being exposed, not being in the same class as fury etc...its all pretty much a nonsense bruh.
     
    Michael Matos likes this.
  12. Remus

    Remus Member

    quite literally, he may very well have done just that. at the very least, he saved his career.

    And lets not forget who breland is, hes not a gym rat boxing academic. he has pedigree fighting DNA. he knows whats what.
     
    Michael Matos likes this.
  13. Hawaiianpunch

    Hawaiianpunch Banned


    A 3rd fight lol. no need for a 3rd fight. I think Fury won the first fight with ease just got caught at the end. But losing one or two rds does not equal a draw. Bottom line he got robbed. On this fight, he put wilder on the back foot because he knew he had a limited fighter in front of him. It was really the best strategy. Teddy said it best. Wilder never learned how to fight. A puncher is born not made. When Wilders right hand never landed he had no plan B. I say Wilder was exposed because many casuals (not the old posters here obviously) were comparing wilder to all-time greats like lewis and Tyson. Obviously, as an all-time HW he's not even close to being on that level. PBC did a nice job of promoting him as a scary monster but the reality is somewhere in the middle. We have seen this before with guys like GGG and Kovalev who were also huge punchers and once they stepped up in competition they looked pretty ordinary. I know you were big on this Wilder guy cause he was exciting and made for great fights. but its safe to say the hype train has come to an end.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
  14. Hawaiianpunch

    Hawaiianpunch Banned


    You're being a tad bit melodramatic don't you think? Doctors say he had a small cut inside his ear. That's were the blood was coming from not like he had internal bleeding(brain swelling). He got roughed up a bit but I never saw him in any type of danger. Even right before the stoppage he was throwing punches. It was a good stoppage from Brelan but had it gone one more Rd he'd still be alive today. I personally would have liked to see Tyson knock him out cold. Then there wouldn't be any excuses. Btw for anybody that has even a shred of boxing knowledge knows the brain trauma boxers sustain during their career comes from sparring not the actual fights. Not to say tragedy can't happen in the ring but what I'm saying if there's brain trauma it's usually already there before they get in the ring.
     
  15. Remus

    Remus Member

    i think the main problem is you don't listen and learn from anyone's responses before you reply. it makes having a discussion a bit of a futile exercise.

    i know this is pointless, but ill say it again. i was big on wilder and am still big on wilder for one reason and one reason alone. he can knock motherfuckers out from anywhere. no one seriously was comparing him to the greats. no one of any credibility anyway. they loved him for the same reason i do...he brings a sense of danger and anticipation which has not been seen since mike.

    oh and btw...the first fight...go back and rescore it. a draw is actually the most likely score. wilder scored 2 10-8 rnds right ? so thats 2 rnds in the bag. do the math, he only has to win 3 of the remaining 10 rounds for it to be a draw. theres at least 1 rnd where wilder clearly won. so now thats 2 of the remaining 9. at least 5 of those 9 were very even...so you dont think theres a chance he won 2 of those 5 ? really? do you know the judge that scored it for fury had wilder winning rnds that the dude that scored it for wilder had wilder losing ?

    dont try and rewrite history. this was a much closer fight than people recall.
     
  16. Remus

    Remus Member

    you are 100% wrong and it shows a serious lack of understanding about this sport and the dangers involved. there has been and will continue to be deaths, serious brain injury or at best, career endings beatings in boxing. this could have been one of them. fury is 270pnds...this isnt a WW fight.
     
  17. Remus

    Remus Member

    im not trying to start any shit here. just being real with you man. too much hyperbole not enough rational assessment.
     
  18. Hawaiianpunch

    Hawaiianpunch Banned

    So in your mind the first fight was close so they're 1-1 now or what are you saying? Lol I don't care what your argument is. I know what I saw and there's no way Fury didn't get robbed. Most fans and boxing media thought Fury won the first fight. For a guy that's so concerned for Wilders safety I'm surprised you want him to jump back in there with Fury after being beaten within an inch of his life. If I was Wilders trainer, manager or promoter I'd keep him as far away from Fury as possible. Realistically it's not a fight he can win. I don't care how much power he has. He's not beating an elite level boxer. This reminds me of Trinidad trying to knockout Hopkins with his left hook. Once Bhop took away that left hook from Trinidad it was a wrap.
     
  19. mex fighter

    mex fighter Meqcksykin

    In this fight, wilder wasn't going to be ko'd with one punch. It was going to be from accumulation and by the 7th, a lot of punches were accumulated. Another 3-4 rounds of that could have been catastrophic.

    Those are the most dangerous knockouts of all, the ones of sustained punishment. As meldrick taylor, ask du ku kim, ask johnny owen, ask kiko bejines.
     
  20. Remus

    Remus Member

    no, im not saying that at all. they have had a draw and fury has won one. you call the first a robbery...how ? do the math. score the fight. yopu on one hand criticie the fans and media for hyping wilder but now youre citing them as evidence that fury was robbed. well which is it ? here's a thought. go back and watch it and score the fight. explain to me how the 2 judges who awarded the fight to opposing fighters couldn't even agree on who won what round. that in and of itself tells you how close some of the rounds were.

    all im saying is one thing...before the fight and after the fight, it all comes down to one thing. can he land the right hand. thats it. period. literally nothing has changed in this matchup. they could fight 10 times and the equation would be the same in fight 1 as it is in fight 10. Wilder was never going to outbox fury and never will.

    you saying "realistically its not a fight he can win" is basically not understanding this match up at all. you keep saying he was exposed, well mex pointed this out straight away. what was exposed ? what did we learn from this fight we didn't already know ?
     

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